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Nazralte · Lore Keeper Joined: 29 Dec 2003 Posts: 790

While at work today I got to thinking about the old days and how much fun, in the beginning, the TWP was. For those that werent around back then, TWP stands for Territorial War Project. Basically it was the main map of Sosaria broken up into sections that guilds would fight for and such. It died mostly due to the vast amount of rules that were made for those who complained about losing.

So, Ive decided to try and bring it back. I have yet to speak with Zym, but im sure he wont mind if I try. I plan to keep the rules fairly simple, yet covering pretty much all the basics of warfare. The only thing I will not set rules on is equipment, pets, and who is involved. These are things that will be discussed between those fighting.

One of the other problems from the TWP was the fact that some broke rules. First it was discussed between the guilds. Then the TWP itself started putting judges and such to watch the battles, and just got worse. This time I would like to do things a bit different. No judges or anything. I think we are all old enough and mature enough to not need them. Secondly, if someone feels that the other side broke a rule, I would want them to tell myself, or anyone else that will be helping me run it, then we would talk to the side that broke the rules. The biggest thing will be watching who is breaking the rules, how often, and also, who is telling us about them and if they are just losing the battles.

Since this is still in the works, I will put down a few of the rules I did think up, so you all can see where im headed with this. Ill start with some of the old rules that I think were good and basic.

One claim a week.
Your claim must be in contact with a section you already control. Also called a land chain.

Raids on others' land-- You can raid once a week, same as a claim. If you successfully raid thier section, they cannot use it in thier land chain for the next claim. You do not need to own a section that touches a raid spot, but you do need some sort of way to get there. My idea on this is to tell me, or of course someone that is working with me, your "land route". If the "land route" goes through unclaimed land, or through friendly lands, you are fine. If it is through enemy lands, then I would give them a chance to catch you moving through it. I would tell them 3 sections that someone is moving though. If they guess which one, then I would set up a time for them to try and catch you IG.

Another big thing these days is being outnumbered. I have thought up a couple ideas to help out with this. First is to have teams somewhat balanced when they fight. Meaning a guild that can have 20 people on the field, may only be allowed to bring 10 since the guild they are fighting only can muster 5. Then of course there is alliances. I think that if a guild has an alliance, and the alliance members want to help, they should be allowed. But again, the numbers would have to even out somewhat.

Lastly is the biggie. Homebases... Back then we had one section that we could not lose. I was never all that happy with that rule, but on the other hand I do understand why its there. Not very fair or fun for a bigger guild to basically take your land. So I havent really thought up anything for it yet. Perhaps one guild could take it, but the guild they took it from has a chance to fight for it back every week.

In the end, I really want the emphasis to be on fun more than anything. I dont want it to turn into a land grab fest, or even to make our RP all about PvP. But I would like our PvP to have some meaning, and to make it fun. This will not be only for FAR or the ARPC. It will be for all to enjoy and have fun with.

As I said, this is just my idea and something I would like to work on. Those that would like to help, just ask me. If anyone has input either way, just post and Ill reply as best I can. Except for those who post that it wont work and dont actually read it through.
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Nazralte
Former Regent of Britannia

Teh Glouris Lrod Kujabis · Transcendent Spammer Joined: 29 Dec 2003 Posts: 5740

OMFG I DIDNT READ THIS POST AT ALL YET I AM GOING TO FLAME IT BLAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

I think we are all mature enough to run this project, yeah. Just as long as we all are considerate of the conditions with home bases and such. The word 'claim' itself makes me want to hurl, but, I think this is the way to do it.

Nazralte · Lore Keeper Joined: 29 Dec 2003 Posts: 790

Something else I though of is only letting guilds hold so many claims. I dont see a guild with like 5 people holding like 30+ sections. I really want this to be about practicality, realism (from a UO standpoint, or like the point of using a grid while playing D&D) and FUN.
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Nazralte
Former Regent of Britannia

Deacon Drake · Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2005 3:57 pm Post subject:

Nazralte... you're my hero.

This idea has my full unabatable support.
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Aerilyn · Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2005 4:22 pm Post subject:

Steel pretty much summed my thoughts up.

Rosar Ashande · Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2005 4:50 pm Post subject:

Since you're going to be artificially limiting numbers anyway, I might have a suggestion for the "homebase" problem.

Allow homebases to be captured. But perhaps, instead of a single, normal battle, the former owners could engage in a war of attrition for their homebase. They get a chance to retake it every week, as you suggested, but even if they're defeated, the defenders can field fewer people in the next battle, the explanation being that they have reduced resources due to an unfriendly population.

This penalty would be cumulative. I suppose at some point the penalty should begin to vanish, maybe whenever the former owners miss an opportunity to attack. The penalty could be fixed, but you could also use the kill tracker from UO's guild war system. It could be half the number killed, rounded up, always at least one unless, of course, the defenders take no losses.
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Nazralte · Lore Keeper Joined: 29 Dec 2003 Posts: 790

Not a bad idea Rosar, but I would really like to keep the rules as simple as I can. I think the very best idea is that if someone wanted to take over a town, they do it right by talking OOC with the people that inhabit the region and discuss some RP ways of it. Like would it just be a war for a bit, neither side winning. Or would it be a few battles, winner take all, ect.

I think the main point of the TWP are creating a visual and interactive setting with basic rules of war that everyone can agree on. I truly would not like to make a rule that lets one guild overtake another just by PvP. Makes it not fun for the smaller guilds.
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Nazralte
Former Regent of Britannia

Teh Glouris Lrod Kujabis · Transcendent Spammer Joined: 29 Dec 2003 Posts: 5740

I think we need to lay down the base "Unbreakable Laws" and then let each individual guild set their own. Some might let their main base be captured. Some might not. Some might let it be captured for such-and-such amount of time.

The goal in this, I think, is to set the Unbreakable Laws, agree on them, then have a nice listing of laws that each guild sets for itself, and plaster it in a nice central page that can be easily updated.

I gonna post again after goona, to follow up a conversation we had without repeating what she might be typing now.

Kaelthir · Certifiable Joined: 28 Aug 2004 Posts: 1932

Once upon a time a year and a bit ago, there was a newly formed guild in Umbra that liked to RP. And RP they would, most of them didn't have a care in Sosaria outside of roleplay. Unfortunately, the good times were cut short when a big powerful guild began to pee all over them. The big guild had many members that couldn't RP very well, but enjoyed PvPing and would constantly raid and chase members of the little guild out of their own land!

I am very wary of joining anything that could easily encourage PvP and put OES in another situation such as this, especially considering I'm trying to rebuild the guild right now. I want to see who is taking part, if a number of reputable RPers are in then I will consider putting OES in. If this is just a group of rules for PvP everyone agrees upon, then that is fine. But if we are forced into PvP, challengers appearing out of NOWHERE every week, I have a very big problem. Most of us probably will be out-numbered, out-skilled, and out-equipped. It is not fun when you are trying to RP and have a giant army charge at you every night.

That being said, I will sit back and watch for now. If it sounds like the TWP is being put together well, and there are rules against all of the problems I just stated, then I'll look into taking part.

Teh Glouris Lrod Kujabis · Transcendent Spammer Joined: 29 Dec 2003 Posts: 5740

More or less, I think everyone should post a goal in mind... I.E. "My guild will participate if ________."

I talked with goona. For OES, OES just wants to make sure that it is guidelines and rules for PVP. A way to control it, maybe make it fun, without forcing PVP when they don't want it.

So for OES... OES is in if the above paragraph is met, and if people are just OOC considerate of proposing fights and such (I.E. never want to hear 'OMFG THE RULE SAYS YOU MUST PVP / GIVE US YOUR BASE / ETC'), and have a few other good roleplayers / RP guilds on the boat. That simple. I'm sure thats the feelings of most guilds too.

Cal Hurst · Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2005 6:14 pm Post subject:

The problem I have seen with ideas like this in the community, is that it starts off with a great foundation, but everyone is way too eager to start laying brick on brick on brick.

Get the foundation set and secure and working, and then start laying bricks. Don't start putting your bricks on a foundation that has not been tested.

I am in full support of this idea, btw Smile

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Nazralte · Lore Keeper Joined: 29 Dec 2003 Posts: 790

Totally agree with you Dragoona. Part of the downfall of the TWP was a few PvP guilds that would half ass RP just for that. I really do not want to see that happen, for as I said, I am all about this being fun for everyone.
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Nazralte
Former Regent of Britannia

Rosar Ashande · Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2005 6:52 pm Post subject:

Teh Glouris Lrod Kujabis · Transcendent Spammer Joined: 29 Dec 2003 Posts: 5740

I agree Rosar, but heres the thing. Imagine you are the GM of like, 10 non-PVPers, and like 10-20 PVP people come up and say 'hey, we are taking over your guildhouse, and never giving it back.' Thus the part about OOC consideration of the rules. People can't be rediculous on either side. People that don't want to PVP should not provoke it, and people that want to PVP should not force it on others just because.

OOC consideration is all. You should have every right to defend a position by not fighting if the attackers are butthole PVPers that roleplay with the tab key.

Rosar Ashande · Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2005 7:25 pm Post subject: